Moz CEO: Sarah Bird

Summary

There are a lot of details to this story, but you'll have to listen in because you're in for a special one! Sarah went from being a pregnant 16-year-old, to graduating law school and becoming an unintentionally great negotiator, to quitting her job at a law firm based on, literally, a dream, to successfully scaling the number one SEO marketing software on the planet.

Podcast Transcript

Note:  There may be errors to this transcript (some funny, some confusing - we used an automated transcription software!)

Ash Faraj  00:04

Hey, it's ash, you want to stick around today to hear how Sarah went from being a pregnant 16 year old to graduating law school and becoming an unintentionally great negotiator to quitting her job at a law firm based on literally a dream to successfully scaling the number one SEO Marketing software on the planet. Sarah grew up in a typical household outside of Tacoma, Washington along with three brothers, which she admits played a key role in allowing her to be comfortable around male energy. And that translated really well into the boardroom. A key moment in her childhood was getting pregnant at 16 years old. So I'm in a classroom with you, Sarah, in high school, who is Sarah,

Sarah Bird  00:53

I was never sort of strongly identified with just one one thing or one backgrounds, but also generally like, so I wasn't teased by anyone. So I was lucky in that I had, you know, my dignity was generally preserved for most of my high school career. And before then, and I think that sort of ability to be a generalist and get along with all types of people has served me really well as an adult and as a CEO, where you do meet all different kinds of people. But also, candidly, like, when I was in junior year, I got pregnant. And so for a while, I was like that pregnant teenage lady and your high school class that everyone was like, Whoa, didn't see that coming? I know, look at your face. Yeah, if you're sitting next to me in high school, or you're probably like, What happened to her? And you know, that was a real, that was a real, just a moment of deep, like, grounding and learning and truth. And who am I and what's important to me, and, you know, when your sort of whole identity is wrapped mostly by how other people see you, you know, they like they were like, Sarah, friendly, good student, nice person. And then they have to confront were bias about what does it mean to be a pregnant teenager? Does that mean that she's irresponsible, she does drugs, she's sexually loose, like her life is ruined, right? There's all of these sort of stereotypes we have about who that person is. And so I was really confronted with my with my own worry about my own future, but also everyone else's just like baggage, you know, their baggage and their bullshit about what it means to be that person. And to have that flip overnight, you know, from overnight to be like, student of the month to, like, Oh, she ruined her life was very significant for me. And, and I think it actually is the root of a lot of the compassion I have for other people. And for people who are less fortunate than I was like this. I'm not the only woman in history, who got had an unplanned pregnancy and as a teenager, but I have much better outcomes. And I know part of that is because of the privilege I was born in the support and love of my parents like my able bodied this, the color of my skin, the fact that, you know, I come from a family that's really well off relative to most people. And so I can I had this like, little glimpse into like, what is it like to be a person for whom everyone else now assumes the worst about you. And they assume that you are not capable of achievement, they assume that you have are only big Bad's bad decisions, right. And so I have a, I have a real like, gigantic heart around not judging people by their worst mistakes, and that everyone is entitled to grace. And that just a constant sort of confrontation with what we think about people is not true about them. It's only true about our thought.

Ash Faraj  03:41

I love that. Thanks for sharing that I saw you had three older brothers,

Sarah Bird  03:46

my sister is 10 years younger than me. So it really was mostly for most of my sort of formative growing up years, I was surrounded by this very male energy. And I think that that has served me tremendously well, because it does, I don't feel at all unusual in a roomful of men. And so in the tech industry, or the finance industry, or the sort of like, you know, these areas that these circles I tend to walk in or when I was doing law or whatever, you know, it just it felt didn't occur to me to feel out of place with Legos is just how it's been my whole life. Plus, I think that in general, it helps me communicate with men more because I was surrounded by video games that we played army and we built forts and like, I feel like while I couldn't attend scouts, I feel like I am a scout because I went through so many the after school scouting programs like visitor on the side, when my brothers were in Dallas, and my mom was a den Mother, you know, like so I just have a think. I just think I'm able to relate to people who grew up in a sort of typical gender norm like male gender kind of paradigm and, and not feel weird about it, because it just yeah, I mean, that was my whole life surrounded by it.

Ash Faraj  04:51

You know, you you had a ballet teacher was very interesting because you had a ballet teacher that really inspired you and it seemed like reading the story. I was like, it doesn't seem like it's inspiring, but you for some reason remebered it.

Sarah Bird  05:03

I remember it, so I remember it so well, I think she is one of the adults that has made the biggest impact on my life in a positive way. And, um, you know, I have I have a little bit of a default in me that it can sometimes really not served me well, which is a really like to make other people comfortable. I like it when everyone around me is happy, and everyone's comfortable. And one of the things I feel really grateful for this ballet teacher, Miss Aaron, is that she helped me a really good example for me of how you can you can help how important it is to push people out of their comfort zone. And how you can challenge people confront people, be candid with people when your intent is to genuinely make them better. And they know it. You know, I mean, she was she was merciless to us, you know, and but she taught us like, if you want your splits, you've got to sit in your splits every day for five minutes on each leg. And yeah, you're gonna cry, but you want the splits or not. And, and she would be, you know, just unabashedly critical of all of your technique, mistakes, but also point out very occasionally, she'd be like, that was a great class come and look at this, like, look at this Rond de Jambe and how her leg is turned out in the arms of her foot and like to see this muscle here this muscle is because she's been holding this position, well, for a long time, and like, you would like maybe once every four months, you would get this like, amazing, detailed positive affirmation that you were doing something right. And really, right. And, you know, I just didn't have a lot of that around me, I didn't have a lot of that from women, the culture I grew up in was mostly like women who were the culture is to be a very accommodating, friendly, your job is to nurture kind of woman and so the lessons she taught me around like perseverance, you know, if you want it, you got to get it. And also, like, sometimes the kindest, best thing you can do for someone is to be really, you know, critical in service of them and their improvement.

Ash Faraj  07:01

That's, that's really cool. That's, well, there's, I feel like I can I want to spend the whole conversation just like your childhood, but

Sarah Bird  07:09

it just gets more interesting.

Ash Faraj  07:11

Yeah. Like, first you say pregnant 16. There's a lot of

Sarah Bird  07:17

getting started.

Ash Faraj  07:20

After high school, you decided to, you know, get your bachelor's in literature and psychology,

Sarah Bird  07:24

philosophy, actually, truly the most unemployable disciplines you can possibly get. Just to be really clear psychology is actually training you for something.

Ash Faraj  07:32

So after high school, Sarah decided to travel up north to Canada to attend Simon Fraser University for her undergraduate degree. She then went to Istanbul in Turkey to study abroad. And then she went to Shanghai in China to study Chinese law before finally returning to Seattle and finishing her law degree at the University of Washington. So you, obviously you, you've spent a lot of your life in education, right, like law school, and you've done a lot of education. Now being where you are in your career, what do you feel like? Like the trade off is like, between education and experience? Like for somebody who wants to become a business leader? Like some a new professional, like, how should they think about whether they should spend another four years in school? or six years in school? Or should they just get that four, six years of experience? You know, I'm saying like, there's

Sarah Bird  08:17

Yeah, I do. I do know, I do know what you're saying, um, you know, so at this point, in my at some point in your career, you're like, Where are you in working long enough? It doesn't matter anymore. how you got to where you are, like, I don't ever interview for like, well, but do they have an MBA? And, you know, did they? Did they go to college, a really good one, or especially in this discipline, I am now at a stage where I'm hiring executives. And what I'm looking at is like, what is their last like, 10 year career history is their 10 year career, if you're in the role, and you've been succeeding in the role, I don't care where you went to school, or how you were formally trained, like, there's, I do believe that that in general, there is more than one path to learning and to success. And I do, I have, I have met people who are incredibly qualified, amazing, wonderful professionals, for whom college was either not a good fit, because of the culture and sort of way of doing college or they didn't have the resources or family support to do college, and they enter that sort of persevering and had good luck, and worked really hard. And I've been able to sort of rise through the ranks to the corporate ranks and gain, you know, lots of opportunity and have success without having that background. So I am not a person who would say, you absolutely have to go through a formal education, you know, that says if you're out on average on a bell curve, it is a great, it's a great experience and a great way to get up to speed and on. I don't regret my education at all, even though I haven't, you know, I'm not currently teaching literature anywhere. I'm not a philosopher, and I'm no longer practicing law. But I don't regret it because I learned a lot of things along the way. And I learned how to express myself I learned discipline, I learned structure or just all that there's lots of good stuff you learn. Along the way, you know, and that said, like, I thought at one time I went through this real crisis in my career around, I was Chief Operating Officer at mana, so not yet the CEO. And we were growing quickly, we were probably like 60 people, and we just taken a round of investments were going to grow even more. And I just kept thinking, like, they need to hire a real COO, they need to hire a real one who knows what they're doing. Because I, you know, I've never even worked at a tech startup. And the chief operating officer and I had this idea in my head, that there would be people out there who are so much better at it than I was, and that if I had gone and gotten an MBA, instead of a law degree, I would be like, this job would be so much easier. So big story around, I'm not good enough. And this job would be easier if I had this MBA or whatever. And so I talked to some advisors, I said, Hey, like thinking like, one moz should hire someone who's already done this job. And two I think I should go get an MBA, and the advisors Thank, God looked at me, and we're like, you know, people go and get MBAs and get the job you already have, right. And then they also have to go and learn all the hard things are already learning. And so they got me. Instead, they recommended a like peer coaching, group and professional coaching group, so that it was not as expensive as an MBA. And also, I could learn from others, I could get that I could get that perspective that other people have in sort of semi similar roles. And I think that was the right decision for me. Because it was twofold. One I did, I did learn from my peers, I loved that curious learning through other people's mistakes and challenges. It's like there's the level of sheer like, Oh, that's cool. But I also learned a potentially more fundamental and interesting thing to discover in leadership, which is, there's no amount of education, that is going to make it an easy job. It's just the reason you're paid the big bucks is because it's a very hard job. It's like I think of it like mountain climbing, like climbing Everest, even if you are a well trained and experienced, mountain climber is still a really hard, big challenge to do. And you just are going to have good days and bad days on the mountain. And this kind of came forward for me as I was, I was listening to these peers in this group. And they were talking about like, Oh, my, my co founders are fighting, like, we're not sure what strategy to take, because we want to grow. But since we haven't been growing, we have to cut costs. And I know which cost to take and I have to do an org design. And they were having all of these like issues like I've discovered that someone else is having an affair with someone else in the company. And now we got to handle like all of those, like really hard things that happen in the workplace. an MBA doesn't actually help you, it's still just really hard. It's just a hard job, to know how to make decisions when you don't have all the information to manage people's interpersonal conflict in a way that is best for them. And for the company. Like, you can't really short circuit shortcut around those. And once I realized, like, Oh, this is just their job. This is just, I'm paid to have good judgment, and I'm paid to make the best decisions possible. And I'm paid to bring out the best in people, and to try to provide clarity, but like, there's no shortcut that's gonna make this easy or feel easy. It's just a really hard job. Like, there's no day we're climbing Everest is not really hard. And some days you're gonna reach the summit, and some days, you're gonna have to turn around because bad weather or your teammate gets hurt. You know, it's just kind of not up to you. It's just just the sport. The sport of leadership, it sucks. You want to get a job do something else.

Ash Faraj  13:26

So after graduating law school from the University of Washington, Sara didn't really know what she wanted to do. As she was having these conversations with people at different law firms, she was really hesitant to commit to offers because she wasn't sure what you wanted to do. Now, since she had a hard time committing people began to perceive her as a great negotiator. And this happened completely unintentionally.

Sarah Bird  13:50

I wasn't really sure I even wanted to be an attorney. But now I had this law degree. And I was like, I want to do something, law degrees are pretty general, I'm going to go apply to a bunch of places. And I just wasn't getting good offers. I wasn't getting interesting roles. I was getting the kind of roles that were like the legal assistant or someone's admin or like I was doing that before I went to law school, I didn't get $65,000 in debt to go and do the same job I did before. And and then I did have an offer from the firm that I had done a little bit of work with. While I was in law school to raise money to travel and read my travels, I was helping write briefs and things and do research. And they made an offer and I was I was not sold that I wanted to do this like small firm, lawyering, like pretty litigation, heavy lawyering and so I kept like being polite to being like, No, I don't I just think I'm going to pursue something else. I'm trying to find like, whatever this other thing, and they thought I was I thought I was negotiating. They thought I was like being a stone cold salary negotiator. They were like, Wow, she is like really, like smooth, like then they want to be even more right and they're Just like so wonderfully raise your offer by whatever another 5k. But I was still really me like, I don't even, I'm not really sure what it was. And so again, I was like, I'm super flattered, you guys are really great, but I'm really looking at some other opportunities. And I just, you know, I think I have other things I need to explore and da da da da. And again, they thought I was negotiating three times, on the third time, like in this over a six week period, they were like, the I was beginning to be nervous that I was like, I'm running out of my student health insurance, like it expires after you leave, you know, your your school after some period of time. And I was like, I need money now. And my bar exam loan thing is running out, I need money to live in insurance. And they came back and you know, I got a much nicer offer. Without any like, and I had this, like, I walked in with this reputation of being like, smooth and not like aggressive, but also like stone cold and which they like really admired even though it's like, none of that is true about me.

Ash Faraj  16:08

Completely unintentional,

Sarah Bird  16:09

totally unintentional, totally unintentional.

Ash Faraj  16:13

So I guess what did you learn? What did you learn about negotiation from that?

Sarah Bird  16:17

Yeah, I think I did learn, I did learn that it's just, it's really valuable to walk away and give it space.

Ash Faraj  16:24

So after three and a half years of practicing law at a law firm, Sara decided to quit her job, literally based on a dream. She quit with no plan. It was just some feeling she had, within one month, one of her friends she had been in touch with for five years, who happened to be the founder of Moz. Asked Sarah to join Moz. How did you get the job at Moz.

Sarah Bird  16:48

So Rand was the original CEO of Moz. And he co founded the company with his mom. So very unusual founding team, a mother-son founding team. And Rand and I had been friends for about five years. At that point, we met through mutual friend to him at law school. And so whenever I'd see that, his best friend growing up went to law school with me, and so I never shared a birthday, or she'd have a potluck, she would throw these amazing parties. I would see Ryan there and his then fiance now wife, and so we just got to know each other, we enjoyed each other. He he was someone I really admired. I thought, Oh, he's so brilliant and very funny. And I just enjoyed his company. And I remember learning, he's kind of internet famous, but I never really knew what about, you know, just so that was sort of hilarious. And then, when I decided to leave the firm, I made the decision to leave the firm. But I hadn't, I didn't know what I was gonna do. Next. I went to dinner with he and Geraldine.

Ash Faraj  17:44

Sorry to stop you here, but why did you Why did you leave the firm in the first place?

Sarah Bird  17:47

Well, this is a very embarrassing story, but a true one. Wow. I know, here we go. Um, I had a dream, and the dream. I quit my law firm job. And like to get more context, like I had, I was not even thinking about quitting that job. I was like, it was not on my mind. I was just grinding hard trying to be the best lawyer I could be trying to be right on. My client is trying to prepare for their cases. I just tried to do my very best. And I had this dream where I quit my job as a lawyer. And in the dream, I started laughing. And I started like, and like, I actually like full body experience joy, and I actually woke myself up from that dream with the with laughter, which I have only ever done like twice in my life. That was one of two times I've ever woken myself up with laughter You know, like, usually you wake yourself like, when you wake up, you're like, oh Man, I'm mad at you I dream last night you you pissed me off and so I'm  mad at you the next morning, or I dreamed you moved away. And so I always felt sad about you. But this was like, so I woke up and I was just a very curious about that. I thought to myself, like oh my god, like I my whole body felt joyful. And I realized, like, this is something I needed to pay attention to, that my body was trying to tell me something that was interesting, and exceptional, and that I needed to like, listen to it. And so I realized like, maybe I should quit my job. Maybe I should quit my job and I gave myself 24 hours to think it over. I said don't do anything dumb today. This is just a dream that probably won't fade by lunch. But, um, didn't fade. And so the next day I gave my notice I gave a lot of notice. Right? I was like look, this is kind of out of nowhere for me to I haven't been contemplating this, but I just know in my heart, it's time for me to move on. I don't know what I'm going to do next. I've got XYZ trials coming up in a couple months. I never want to leave our clients out to dry and I want to give you time to transition. So like in the next three months, let's find a way for me to leave and leave in a way that's good for you in our in our clients. And, by the way, like I don't usually make decisions from dreams. This is a very unusual Not what I typically recommend.

Ash Faraj  20:03

Okay, so no, sorry, how did you land at Moz.

Sarah Bird  20:07

So I had this dream, I quit my job, I gave lots of notice. And I was out. I was out to dinner with Rand and Geraldine, I just said, Oh my God, I've done this crazy thing. I don't know what I'm going to do next. But I've quit my job. And I got I got three months to figure it out. And at that time, Rand was just talking to some investors about maybe doing a first investment in his company. And he said, You should come and join Moz. And I remember thinking, like, I've never really understood what you're doing. I know, it's internet marketing. I know you're a little internet famous. I've never been a part of a technology startup before. But, you know, he was like, Well, you could write about legal issues. And we do we have all these contracts we could review. And like, we were both very naive about the process of running a business and what you need and the skills but we were very confident about mutual respect, shared values, and, and he was very clear, like, they need help, and they want help. And I was very clear that I like helping. So I felt I felt like I should go, I should take this opportunity, I should join the company as the eighth employee at the time. And I will learn as much as I can. And even if it's a bad decision, I told myself, even if it doesn't work, even if it's not what I wanted to do, I'm going to give it one year, I'm going to stick out for a year. And you know, worst case scenario, I thought, in my mind, worst case scenario is like I go back and get a typical legal job in 12 months, which is not that long to be out of the field. And I know I'll be able to like, get back in with my contacts.

Ash Faraj  21:36

One year later. It's 2008. You stayed at Moz.

Sarah Bird  21:40

Yeah, I did stay I did stay at Moz, it's you know, and I will say like, it was a very challenging was nothing like I thought it would be I was vastly unprepared. I am. I think those were some of my hardest professional years. Not the hardest. I've had a couple harder since then. But some of the hardest. And I'm and I have no regrets. Right. I think there is no one in their right mind. Who would have given me that. Like, I would not be the CEO of Moz today, if I hadn't had someone take a crapshoot on me just like, I don't know, let her try it. And then what I was able to grow with the company, right, like I was able to, to learn things to hire experts to surround myself with people who could teach me how to how do you run Finance? How do you build products? You know, how do you do customer support? How do you do marketing, and I was just a sponge and wanted to learn everything I could. And also, you know, I am an organized person. And you will not know it all from this interview. But I don't actually make decisions based on dreams. I'm usually very weighted pros and cons call a lifeline expert person. And that, you know, that sort of like methodical cost benefit analysis that they teach you in law school, they teach you like cost benefit analysis constantly, and they teach you to phone an expert all the time. And I just like took that to running a company. And I would every time I would hire an expert, you know, I go out and if I need to talk to someone who knows, I need to talk to a great CMO, like how am I going to run this marketing team, I don't know how to do it. I would say like your job is to train me like I, I only want to hire you if you're comfortable also teaching me because I have a lot to learn. And when when you move on to your next consulting client, like I want to have it, I want to be a better person and more skilled. And so I would sort of bake that into the relationship from the get go and then genuinely try to be as open as possible to expertise and wisdom. And also at the time, like I was one of the oldest people in office. And so and I knew the basics around like, well, we should have board meetings and we should like definitely file business licenses and file taxes. And we should like have stock option, Ledger's like I do just enough about how corporations get into trouble for my litigation game. But people were like, Wow, you're so good at this. Like I was like, we should probably have a board meeting and I showed up at the first board meeting with like a binder and a highlighter, like the smallest and most ridiculously light agenda because we had no idea what we were doing. But people were just like, oh my god, she has a highlighter. She took notes. And then she emailed doesn't have to worry about follow up emails. And they were just like, so like the bar to excellence was very low at the very earliest stage of excellence is much higher now. But at the very earliest days, it was just like, we have a grown up. I was like the grown up in the room. You know, I was almost like 29 or something but they're like we have grown up.

Ash Faraj  24:30

Okay, I want to pick your brain just a little bit on like hiring so obviously beyond the basics, like if somebody let's see you got 10 candidates for one job. How do you like how do you like if you were the interviewer right like you personally? What do you look for beyond the basics?

Sarah Bird  24:47

I always look for willingness to like admit a mistake and learn because i think i think learning is a core value of mine. I think it's a core value of great leaders. I think that there is This most of the interview process is designed to highlight your competence and your achievements, which is good. But I think it's also important interview for humility around like, can you admit a mistake and do learn from the mistake? And so I'm always trying to get a little bit at like, you know, well, what went wrong about that? Tell me about a time when you had a guest really screw you over? Like they showed up? Or they weren't prepared? Or like, how did you handle it or whatever it is right to really try to understand where people's learnings and what happens when they're in conflict? And can they be humble as well? Since I think most of the interview process is designed to be like, I am a really amazing, and you should pay me lots of money.

Ash Faraj  25:36

So you so humility is important.

Sarah Bird  25:38

Yeah, humility in service of learning.

Ash Faraj  25:40

What -- so I don't know if you interview like directly with like new professionals or not, because I know you say you're looking for executives most of the time, but I guess give us some insight on some of the things that you some of the things that you see that it's like, they shouldn't be doing that or like some of the do's and don'ts that you see very often, I guess,

Sarah Bird  25:56

you know, what is true of both experienced professionals and people early like the niceties do matter, like being on time saying thank you doing a follow up. I think that professionals, we're experienced professionals have more confidence, and they're more aware. And so they'll send you like that, thank you in the follow up, and they'll be brave and said that, hey, I haven't heard from you in a week. But I know, you guys said you were looking at these roles I want to check in because I'm really interested in this role. And I think that's something that a person would experience and confidence does. I think it's someone who is less confident feels like, they'd rather just sit in agony, wondering if they're ever going to hear back out about the role rather than send the email that's like, Hey, I'm checking in because I really haven't heard anything about this role since I interviewed and I'm really excited about it. And I wondered if you have any other questions for me, because I'm super excited about your company. I think there's, there's little things like that actually do make a big difference. And can show like, this person is serious. They care, they understand follow up, and they do it in a way that is comes across as eager, not frustrated. Not like Why didn't you contacted me, you said you would have a decision by such and such matters. Little things little things matter.

Ash Faraj  27:01

eagerness matters to like to show.

Sarah Bird  27:05

Eager and follow up.

Ash Faraj  27:13

Something I personally look for when I decide to partner with someone or hire someone is...

Sarah Bird  27:20

growth mindset.

Ash Faraj  27:22

The most important quality in a leader is...

Sarah Bird  27:24

integrity.

Ash Faraj  27:25

The most important life skill is...

Sarah Bird  27:28

growth mindset.

Ash Faraj  27:29

What do you mean by growth mindset?

Sarah Bird  27:31

I mean, always persistence and willingness to learn. If you don't let a little setback get in your way you go, what can I learn from this? You don't say I'm born a good reader, you say I want to be a better reader. And so I'm going to practice that I'm not a good reader yet. Or, in my case, I'm not a great cook. But I should change that I'm not a great cook yet and keep trying.  

Ash Faraj  27:48

something I've personally struggled with as a leader has been...

Sarah Bird  27:51

confrontation,

Ash Faraj  27:52

when I start to feel the urge to be lazy. I...

Sarah Bird  27:56

don't ever really have that urge.

Ash Faraj  27:57

Really?

Sarah Bird  27:58

Yeah, no, I don't. It's like maybe like once every five years, I'll be like, I just want to be lazy, like my idea of lazy is like, I'm going to make a list of like 15 things to do. There are things that I just want to do for fun, like my idea of lazy, or women to take a lazy day, and I'm going to like plant 65 bulbs, pay all my bills, cook a meal, call a friend. Lazy, it's like I'm gonna like sit and read a book or take a nap or like binge watch a television show. And like I don't have I don't have those days really almost ever. Like very, very rarely. Maybe if I was really sick.

Ash Faraj  28:35

If I could go back and talk to the 25 year old Sarah, I would tell her...

Sarah Bird  28:40

keep going it's going to be all right.

Ash Faraj  28:42

One setback or failure in my early 20s. I will never forget is...

Sarah Bird  28:47

we get really big screw up on a product launch in the earliest days. That was that was pretty devastating and took probably two years to recover from. There's a whole like methodological approach to how we build projects. We built the new product, marketed it and launched it that I think we dug out of for like 18 months. Isn't that good? I wish I could go back in time and be like, let's just pause here. Because we could do over a new approach.

Ash Faraj  29:14

On a more positive note, the sweetest moment I felt in my entire career was when...

Sarah Bird  29:19

Oh, wow. Oh, sweet. Yeah, no, I have so many. Like I'm thinking I'm so many I have like, I have so many like I was thinking about there is a there's a couple who met at Moz like I had a single a single mom who had had a really tough time and she worked really hard doing the best she could and then eventually she fell in love with another guy in our office and they like got married and had this like beautiful family and I just feel like now like we were the place they met and fell in love and like it just felt really proud of both of them. They both like really grew in their career and they found each other It's like when you think the word sweet trigger is very much like that kind of emotional, sweet loveliness and type people get married at Moz like they They were like using the office as their wedding space. And like, I feel like that fits like so much good Juju

Ash Faraj  30:04

Moz I have to start a dating division of business. If I could be remembered for just one thing, it would be...

Sarah Bird  30:13

I want to be known as a leader who helped everybody do everybody do their best work, not just some people that who help everybody do their best work. And that tries to capture both these ideas of I believe in and working hard and excellence. And I believe very much in giving everyone the opportunity to get and I don't think that that happens in a lot of places today. And it doesn't happen all the time at Moz. You know, but it's my aspiration to be the kind of place that no matter who you are, where you come from, or what you look like, you can do your best work.

Ash Faraj  30:43

And the last one is if I were stranded on an island and I had access to one meal, my meal would be...

Sarah Bird  30:49

Oh, my word is definitely a card plus cheese combo, right like yeah, it could be like a fettuccine. It could even just be like a grilled cheese like it's something.

Ash Faraj  31:01

Thank you so, so much for listening. If you enjoyed this episode, please please, please leave us a rating review on Apple podcasts. It only takes just a few seconds, but it's worth so much to us. We're helping new professionals in a very unique way and we need people to hear about it. We need you to help us reach more people by leaving us a rating review. We hope to see you again next week. Take care